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Torque » Torque OBD ECU Scanner » Torque Discussion / Ideas » Trans temp, IAT, and MAP

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Author Topic: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
MAFoElffen
Member
Posts: 27
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: March 6, 2014 (GMT)

Quote from m j on March 5, 2014

I think the CCT is the resultant of looking at perdels, havent looked at it much as the CCT is very common to fail to the point it isnt trusted much but the perdel is the actual % number

someone with AE will have to answer that properly I think as I havent looked at a fancier scan on this truck and I never used CCT on my 4.6

What exactly would you like me to check with AE? And I have a “Y” cable so I can run both together for comparison… I don’t know what “CCT” is.

Various experience and interests

m j
Member
Posts: 92
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: March 6, 2014 (GMT)

does AE report live the % amounts or do they do the same CCT results that the self test does?

MAFoElffen
Member
Posts: 27
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: March 7, 2014 (GMT)

Like I said, I don’t know what “CCT” means. Let me go out to my truck with my laptop and I’ll tell you what it reads TFT in… I remember it reads TFT live, but I can’t remember for sure what it reads it in…

EDIT– In temperature degrees F

Various experience and interests

Capp777
Member
Posts: 2917
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: March 7, 2014 (GMT)

Cylinder Contribution Test for diagnosing.

MAFoElffen
Member
Posts: 27
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: March 7, 2014 (GMT)

Okay… Different. Will look at it.

As explained to me on that… OBS does things differently than SD. CCT on an OBS kills an injector (one cylinder), one at a time as it is measuring the drop in RPM during each drop.

For the later SD’s… ’99 on, there is talk that they can’t turn off one injector at a time like the OBS’es can, so they do things differently. Some think AE looks at the SD’s cylinder rotational values and gets a result back from there. The KEOR on demand test for the SD’s is “Perdel”…

Then CCT is run via selecting “Power Balance” test from the drop down menu… I went out to my truck and tried to start… Batteries are down and have my other truck jumping it at the moment. I know you get numbers back from that… back I’ll have to get to you later to tell you what form those numbers are in…

EDIT– So I hear that OBS is not Perdels… but rather gotten mathematically from the RPM drop. AE didn’t have that worked out for themselves until sometime last year (and doesn’t work for AE without their New Proline adapter… I have that.) The Contribution part of that, is that the RPM drop should be the same with each cyliner dropped out. If so then all are contributing equally. If one is dropped and it doesn’t drop the rpm’s or not equally, then that cylinder is not pulling it’s weight.

That was the same like we used to do manually by pulling spark plug wires or with the valve covers off a PSD and disconnecting the injector connectors.

(Stalling while my truck charges back up…) LOL

Various experience and interests

MAFoElffen
Member
Posts: 27
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: March 7, 2014 (GMT)

Argh!!! Truck started and running… Then my laptop battery went dead. Am charging that now while my truck is charging it’s own battery. (My wife has my inverter.)

Various experience and interests

MAFoElffen
Member
Posts: 27
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: March 8, 2014 (GMT)

Sidetracked. Got it started, but wasn’t charging. That was okay. Lifetime warranty on the alternator. I guess 9 years old is not much to ask from an alternator and got to use my warranty…

They are honoring it, but had to order it. It wasn’t a shelf item = 215 amp ambulance package. Tomorrow…

Various experience and interests

jschildm
Member
Posts: 29
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: March 10, 2014 (GMT)

Here is one running down the road on a 2.5 hr road trip with a horse trailer and 2 horses. You can see the values from torque in the picture below. My mechanical Trans Temp gauge was pretty well stuck at 125 deg F most of the time. I am not sure where the trucks temp sensor is, but if it is in the cooling line that would explain some temperature difference since my mechanical sensor is in the test port (pan).

I don’t have one with KOEO to look at my EBP and I didn’t think to take a look at it.

I did get the throttle position to work. I used the equation MJ posted for TP 1, the 2 bit equation from CAPP with the other information for the PID remaining the same for TP 2, and the voltage also posted by CAPP for the TP V.

Below are the results as I slowly pressed in the peddle and then slowly let it out.

Throttle Position OBS 1 Throttle Position OBS 2 Throttle Position OBS Volts
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
13.75080013 13.53911972 0.63476598
13.75080013 13.53911972 0.63476598
20.32979965 20.1439209 0.96885329
20.32979965 20.1439209 0.96885329
26.90880013 26.74872017 1.30294061
26.90880013 26.74872017 1.30294061
32.17200089 32.03255844 1.57021058
32.17200089 32.03255844 1.57021058
36.55799866 36.21559906 1.7817992
36.55799866 36.21559906 1.7817992
40.50540161 40.39863968 1.99338782
40.50540161 40.39863968 1.99338782
43.57559967 43.48088074 2.14929533
43.57559967 43.48088074 2.14929533
43.57559967 43.48088074 2.14929533
46.64580154 46.5631218 2.30520272
51.03179932 50.7461586 2.51679134
51.03179932 50.7461586 2.51679134
52.34759903 52.17720032 2.58917689
52.34759903 52.17720032 2.58917689
53.66339874 53.3880806 2.65042639
53.66339874 53.3880806 2.65042639
54.10200119 54.15864182 2.68940306
54.10200119 54.15864182 2.68940306
56.29499817 56.25016022 2.79519749
56.29499817 56.25016022 2.79519749
56.29499817 56.25016022 2.79519749
58.48799896 58.45175934 2.90655994
58.48799896 58.45175934 2.90655994
61.11959839 60.98360062 3.03462672
61.11959839 60.98360062 3.03462672
63.75120163 63.6255188 3.16826177
63.75120163 63.6255188 3.16826177
66.38279724 66.15735626 3.29632854
66.38279724 66.15735626 3.29632854
68.57579803 68.57911682 3.4188273
68.57579803 68.57911682 3.4188273
70.3302002 70.12023926 3.49678087
72.08460236 72.10167694 3.59700704
72.08460236 72.10167694 3.59700704
74.27760315 74.08312225 3.69723344
74.27760315 74.08312225 3.69723344
74.27760315 74.08312225 3.69723344
76.47059631 76.28472137 3.8085959
76.47059631 76.28472137 3.8085959
78.22499847 78.04599762 3.89768577
78.22499847 78.04599762 3.89768577
80.8565979 80.79799652 4.0368886
80.8565979 80.79799652 4.0368886
83.92680359 83.9903183 4.19836426
83.92680359 83.9903183 4.19836426
86.11979675 85.97176361 4.29859066
86.11979675 85.97176361 4.29859066
86.99700165 87.07256317 4.35427189
86.99700165 87.07256317 4.35427189
86.99700165 87.18264008 4.35983992
86.99700165 87.18264008 4.35983992
86.99700165 87.18264008 4.35983992
86.99700165 87.18264008 4.35983992
86.99700165 87.18264008 4.35983992
86.99700165 87.18264008 4.35983992
87.43560028 87.29271698 4.36540794
87.43560028 87.29271698 4.36540794
86.99700165 87.18264008 4.35983992
86.99700165 87.18264008 4.35983992
87.43560028 87.29271698 4.36540794
87.43560028 87.29271698 4.36540794
86.99700165 86.85240173 4.34313536
86.99700165 86.85240173 4.34313536
77.34780121 77.49559784 3.86984515
77.34780121 77.49559784 3.86984515
74.71620178 74.85368347 3.73621011
74.71620178 74.85368347 3.73621011
71.20739746 71.33112335 3.55803037
71.20739746 71.33112335 3.55803037
69.89160156 69.90007782 3.48564458
69.89160156 69.90007782 3.48564458
66.38279724 66.2674408 3.30189657
66.38279724 66.2674408 3.30189657
62.87400055 62.8549614 3.12928486
62.87400055 62.8549614 3.12928486
60.68099976 60.54328156 3.01235437
60.68099976 60.54328156 3.01235437
58.04940033 58.121521 2.88985562
58.04940033 58.121521 2.88985562
56.73360062 56.47032166 2.80633378
56.73360062 56.47032166 2.80633378
55.4178009 55.14936066 2.73951626
55.4178009 55.14936066 2.73951626
50.15459824 50.19575882 2.48895073
50.15459824 50.19575882 2.48895073
44.89139938 44.80184174 2.21611285
44.89139938 44.80184174 2.21611285
40.94400024 40.83895874 2.01566029
40.94400024 40.83895874 2.01566029
35.24219894 34.89464188 1.71498168
35.24219894 34.89464188 1.71498168
31.73340034 31.7023201 1.55350614
31.73340034 31.7023201 1.55350614
27.7859993 27.6293602 1.34748566
27.7859993 27.6293602 1.34748566
24.2772007 23.99671936 1.16373765
24.2772007 23.99671936 1.16373765
19.89119911 19.59351921 0.94101268
19.89119911 19.59351921 0.94101268
15.94379997 15.52056026 0.73499215
15.94379997 15.52056026 0.73499215
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.10807991 0.56238037
12.43500042 12.10807991 0.56238037
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661
12.43500042 12.32824039 0.57351661

Capp777
Member
Posts: 2917
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: March 11, 2014 (GMT)

Jschildm:

Will you be able to compare these
numbers against your AE readings?

The percentage equations may need
further adjustments to match readings.

jschildm
Member
Posts: 29
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: March 11, 2014 (GMT)

Unfortunately I don’t have AE. Wouldn’t that be nice.

Capp777
Member
Posts: 2917
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: March 11, 2014 (GMT)

Quote from jschildm on February 6, 2014
Quote from m j on February 6, 2014
I dont have AE. that is torque with the last formula Capp gave me

I can try and get mine I the next few days of you want to compare, since you think yours might be acting funny.

End Quote.

Sorry, I misunderstood.

jschildm
Member
Posts: 29
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: March 11, 2014 (GMT)

Quote from Capp777 on March 11, 2014
Sorry, I misunderstood.

I just read back through that section and I can see where that was confusing. I don’t have AE, but was going to compare the throttle position equation I got from torque for MJ, since he thought there might be something going on with his pedal.

MAFoElffen
Member
Posts: 27
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: March 12, 2014 (GMT)

I’m the one that has AE and a “Y” cable so I can see both at the same time…

Quote from Capp777 on March 11, 2014
Quote from jschildm on February 6, 2014
Quote from m j on February 6, 2014

I dont have AE. that is torque with the last formula Capp gave me

I can try and get mine I the next few days of you want to compare, since you think yours might be acting funny.

End Quote.

Sorry, I misunderstood.

Various experience and interests

jschildm
Member
Posts: 29
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: March 18, 2014 (GMT)

Any idea when you would be able to do a comparison. I don’t even think it would have to be at the same time. Just a KOEO data log with torque pushing the pedal to the floor from idle. Then a repeated run of the same thing with AE. Comparing the value for volts and percentage from AE should get us pretty darn close.

Quote from MAFoElffen on March 12, 2014
I’m the one that has AE and a “Y” cable so I can see both at the same time…
End Quote.

MAFoElffen
Member
Posts: 27
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: March 29, 2014 (GMT)

Quote from jschildm on March 18, 2014
Any idea when you would be able to do a comparison. I don’t even think it would have to be at the same time. Just a KOEO data log with torque pushing the pedal to the floor from idle. Then a repeated run of the same thing with AE. Comparing the value for volts and percentage from AE should get us pretty darn close.

Didn’t notice this until now. (Finals) Will do…

On another subject- remember “Turbo Drive Efficiency”? Still want to work that out…

Have to build a cat condo/scratching toy today… then will log that data.

Various experience and interests

jschildm
Member
Posts: 29
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: April 1, 2014 (GMT)

Quote from MAFoElffen on March 29, 2014

Quote from jschildm on March 18, 2014
Any idea when you would be able to do a comparison. I don’t even think it would have to be at the same time. Just a KOEO data log with torque pushing the pedal to the floor from idle. Then a repeated run of the same thing with AE. Comparing the value for volts and percentage from AE should get us pretty darn close.
Didn’t notice this until now. (Finals) Will do…

On another subject- remember “Turbo Drive Efficiency”? Still want to work that out…

Have to build a cat condo/scratching toy today… then will log that data.

I think you should be able to use an equation similar to the boost alternate equation where you can use the PID Long Name to call from multiple places.

jschildm
Member
Posts: 29
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: April 4, 2014 (GMT)

Is the PCM on our trucks smart enough to do gear and TC lock? I know the PCM sends a ground signal for the TC lock, but don’t know if we would be able to display it in torque. Just curious if anyone had thoughts on this.

cowmilker08
Member
Posts: 6
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: April 8, 2014 (GMT)

TC lock-up is an interesting idea. I updated Torque, but haven’t had a chance to try it out since I updated it. Did I read correctly that Torque now accepts powers (^) in the equations?

Is there anything I should try to help figure out how to get the TP gauge to work?

jschildm
Member
Posts: 29
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: April 15, 2014 (GMT)

I hauled some horses on a 2.5 hour trip this weekend. I didn’t have it running the whole time, but I did get a screen shot with the transmission temp and a shot of my analog gauge.

The analog gauge is 10 or 15 degrees lower than torque reads, but if the sensor for the truck is on the hot side, and my analog gauge reads from the test port (pan), then that might not be too far off.

Capp777
Member
Posts: 2917
Post Re: Trans temp, IAT, and MAP
on: May 29, 2014 (GMT)

Jschildm:

Your trans temp matches my data for
0.9 – 1.0 volts +/- about 3°.

I too believe the 10 – 15 °F difference between
your display and your gauge is due to the
location of the sensors.

Its interesting to note that Toyota owners have
reported 10 – 18 °F delta temps between their
cooler versus pan temps. (Toyotas have sensors
for both locations).

Edit:

Some of your 7.3 buddies on a different forum (FTE)
are trying to use our linear equations for TFT
which will not work at the ends of the “S” and will
not properly show an overheat condition!

The poly equations are the ones to use.

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